A Discussion on Evangelism: Theology in Action

Tony Caffey: Welcome back to Theology in Action. My name is Tony Caffey, and I'm the senior pastor of Verse by Verse Fellowship, and I'm here today with my good friend Forrest Tilger. Hey, Forrest, how you doing?

Forrest Tilger: Good.

Tony Caffey: So you share my love for the church? Yes. Or eldering. We've been serving together as Elders for a year now. Getting tired of me yet, Forrest?

Forrest Tilger: Not yet.

Tony Caffey: Okay. Time blast. You would tell me if you were.

Forrest Tilger: I would. I would tell you absolutely.

Tony Caffey: No, I appreciate serving with you. It's been really enjoyable to to pastor and Shepherd and Elder in the church. And you and I have always had good exchange of ideas as we've talked through the church, but I want to talk to you today about something I know that you're really passionate about. We might work in different Elder topics too, but in my interaction with you over the last year, I know that you're really passionate about evangelism. Yeah, evangelism is, I think, I had you have a lot of passion for evangelism and even a gifting, I would say, you know, you seem to have, you know, this desire, uh, that comes from the Holy Spirit inside of you, like, "I got to share my faith." And maybe that goes back to just your own, um, coming to Christ. I'd like to start there because I heard your story. Yeah. Tell me about how you came to Christ and tell me, tell me how that transpired here in San Antonio. Here in San Antonio? Yeah.

Forrest Tilger: So I'm, I'm from San Antonio. I'm a local guy, born and raised. Yeah. So if you ever want to know a good Mexican restaurant, let me know and I'll be able to hook you up. Uh, I was actually raised in a small Gospel Church on the south side of San Antonio. Okay. Shelter and Armstrong Gospel. But I was not saved. And, um, so the pastor was evangelistic. He was very evangelist.

Tony Caffey: You were just, you weren't having it?

Forrest Tilger: I was not. Uh, the Lord hadn't called me yet. Okay. That's how I want to kind of phrase it, if you will. And, um, fast forward. I was, my, I met a girl in college and I wanted to marry this girl and her father said, "Hey, if you want to marry my daughter, you have to graduate from college." And I had one class left. I had put off math forever. And they were offering a math class at Fort Sam Houston on Wednesday nights. And, um, on Saturday, a gentleman came and knocked on my door. His name is Jason. And he introduced himself.

Forrest Tilger: He said, "Hi, my name is Jason and I'm from Bible Baptist Church just down the road. I'm just coming by. I wanted to talk to you and share the good news of Jesus Christ with you." And I was very much, I was a jerk to him, to be honest with you. I was not very nice.

Tony Caffey: Yeah, even though you grew up in the church, even though you had some exposure to the gospel.

Forrest Tilger: Yeah, I think I was this Saturday, man. I was trying to watch wrestling and this guy comes and knocks at my door, you know. That's right. And so, uh, he starts talking to me and, um, and I cut him off. I said, "Jason," I said, "Let me finish your sentence for you." I said, "Let me guess, you have a church on Sunday morning, you have Sunday school, and then you have service. You probably have Sunday night service, then maybe have a Wednesday night bible study, and then on Saturday you do a walk around the neighborhood. Am I right?" He goes, "Yeah, that's exactly right." I said, "Okay, I know where you're at. You know, if I have any questions, I'll give you a call. Appreciate you." And I kind of, that was, I thought that was the end of it, right?

Tony Caffey: Okay. I haven't heard this part of the story.

Forrest Tilger: Okay. So then my father had given me an '88 Ford Ranger that had the AC Delco stock radio, but it had a short in it. So I couldn't control the radio. I could turn it on, but it wouldn't turn on. I could turn it off, wouldn't turn off. I didn't have any control of it. So I'm leaving, uh, Wednesday night my math class, and I'm on I-35 in Walters, and I hit a bump and the radio comes on. This guy comes on the radio and he starts talking about hell and he starts talking about the eternality of hell. Yeah. And he starts talking about the consequences of sin. And I just felt convicted. The Holy Spirit used that pastor to convict me and I knew right then if I died out, I knew I was going to go. And so it was Wednesday night, so I actually drove to that church and I parked and I got out and I walked up and Jason, to the guy who, yes. Yeah, the guy that came to my Saturday. I said, "Jason!" He's like, "Forrest?" And I was like, "Yeah." Because, "What are you doing here?" I said, "Buddy, I need to accept Christ my savior right now." He goes, "You owe me a legion in prayer." And I'm like, "No, I need, I know what I need to do." So I just, I, you know, I bowed and I, I asked Christ to forgive me of my sins.

Forrest Tilger: And I, I said, "Lord, take these sins away from me. I want to, I want you to control my life, Lord." And I felt like a weight had been lifted off my shoulders, if you will. And I looked up and there was a baptismal and I said, "Hey, can I get baptized?" He's like, "Right now?" And I'm like, "Yeah, right now." So I got baptized. We went to go eat at a Mexican restaurant called Don Pedro's. And I went to my house and my mom and my fiance at the time, Jennifer, were waiting for me very skeptical because they knew how I was. They're like, "Where has this guy been? Why is his hair all wet?" You know? And I told my mom, I was like, "Mom, I just got saved." My wife grew up Catholic, she was like, "What do you mean, saved?" Right? And so that was the moment where the Lord called me and, and it was a very, my life has never been the same since.

Tony Caffey: Was your mom supportive? Was she excited for you? Was that something she wanted for you as a child? It didn't happen.

Forrest Tilger: Yes, my mom, she was a prayer warrior. Okay. I remember fondly as, as I would, and I think evangelism really starts with prayer. That's really where it starts. And I can recall instances in which I would go back and want to talk to my mother and she'd be kneeling down beside her bed praying. And I would leave. I'd come back three minutes later and she'd still be there. And I get frustrated, come back another 30 minutes and she'd still be praying. But that was the heart that she had. And I, that's really where evangelism starts. It starts with prayer. And I think if you're going to have an evangelism mindset, you got to be somebody who's praying earnestly and asking God to give you opportunities. And then when those opportunities come forward, you have to be willing to step into them.

Tony Caffey: I know the answer to this, yes, but just for everybody else's benefit, who was the pastor that was preaching on the radio?

Forrest Tilger: I come to find out it was John MacArthur.

Tony Caffey: Okay, but you didn't know at first?

Forrest Tilger: No, I didn't know it. Okay. I had no idea. It was on 6:30 A.M. KSLR.

Tony Caffey: So your truck hits a bump, a bump on the rut.

Forrest Tilger: Right.

Tony Caffey: The radio comes on.

Forrest Tilger: Yeah.

Tony Caffey: That's like a country music song. And then you hear a pastor preaching about hell.

Forrest Tilger: That's right.

Tony Caffey: And you gave your life to Christ.

Forrest Tilger: That's right. Yeah.

Tony Caffey: Now the, I went to a church that, uh, the previous pastor went to Master's Seminary. Oh, yeah.

Forrest Tilger: And so he, John MacArthur, came to our church when they had their, uh, initial Sunday service.

Tony Caffey: Okay. And I had an opportunity to share that with him. What'd he say?

Forrest Tilger: He says, uh, he goes, "You'd be surprised how many people come and up to me and tell me how the radio, how the Lord used that ministry to draw people into himself." So it's very powerful.

Tony Caffey: Let's go, Forrest. Well, thanks for sharing that. And then Jennifer got saved later, right?

Forrest Tilger: A couple of months afterwards.

Tony Caffey: Yeah. And you know, you've got three kids, one that's grown and married, two teenagers. So you're living for the Lord, evangelizing even your own family as well as here in the church. But let me ask you this question because you've said a couple times already and that's, and it sounds like John MacArthur, to be honest, when you talk about, "when the Lord called me," as if this is God's work, which I agree with you, and I agree with MacArthur on that. But let me ask you a present question, if, if it is the Lord's work indeed, why, why should we evangelize? If God's going to get saved people saved, why should we even try or make an effort to?

Forrest Tilger: Yeah, good question. So I think of, I think of the Apostle Paul who probably is the one who wrote the most about, um, the effectual calling of Christ and he was the biggest evangelist there was.

Tony Caffey: Yep.

Forrest Tilger: And so as that example, you know, I know that, um, so after, you know, after I was saved and I really, I was, I'm a salesman. I trade. That's what I do for a living. I'm in sales. And so, um, like I, I started, one advantage, I was really bad initially. I was too much aggressive, you know, totally aggressive. And then I thought that it really depended on me. And so I went back and I had to rework my script, keep on reworking my script over and over and over.

Tony Caffey: So you wouldn't have said at that time, you know, that this is the Lord's work and he's doing it. That's a theological understanding that you came to.

Forrest Tilger: That's right. I was, I, my wife and I were living in South Texas at the time and, um, we met an individual who was a Reformed Baptist pastor and he handed me, he asked me, he goes, "You know RC Sproul is?" I said, "No, I have no idea who he is." And so he gave me Chosen by Godby R.C. Sproul and I read it and I was, it really, it helped me because initially I, my impression was that I, it was up to me whether or not that person accepted Christ.

Tony Caffey: That's, that's a huge burden.

Forrest Tilger: It is, it is. And, and that forced me to go back and say, "Okay, well, now I need to say this. Now I need to say that." And when I realized that's not my job, you know, my job is to share the gospel. The Holy Spirit is the one who is going to draw that person into Christ. And sometimes, um, I might be the one who plants the seed. Sometimes I might be the one who's going to water that. And sometimes I do get an opportunity to reap that harvest. And I have had some opportunities to reap harvest and it's nothing, it's a joyous, it's very, it's, um, it's a wonderful experience to be able to spend time with somebody and then share the gospel with them and then trust in the Lord. It's a, it's awesome.

Tony Caffey: Yeah, that helps us not take too much ownership of it if somebody doesn't get saved, like, "I didn't say that the gospel writer, I screwed things up." But it also protects us from pride on the other side too, where it's like, "Well, I saved that person. I saved that person." Now you're just your vehicle. Right.

Forrest Tilger: Absolutely.

Tony Caffey: You know, you're, you're a jar of clay to use, uh, Paul's language or an instrument in the Lord's hand to be used or an, the ambassador language of Second Corinthians 5 is really good. We have this opportunity to represent Christ and to serve as a spokesman for him, but, uh, we've, we've got to admit, the work is his. You alluded to that as well with your reference to prayer because that's another part that we can have in the process.

Forrest Tilger: Yeah. And pray and intercede whenever, you know, if you think of that's why it really starts with prayer and it's being very thoughtful about praying. If it's going to be something that if you have, you start your morning with it and you ask the Lord, "Lord, if there's opportunities for me to share the gospel, somebody, help me to be faithful to walk into them." Right. As it on an individual basis, if you have more of a structured where you're going to do it as a church before an event, you definitely want to bathe that in prayer. Yeah. Good. Right. And so with the prayers are very, and that's, you know, in your conversation with the Lord, and that's really how salvation starts. It starts with prayer from the sinner's perspective, they're calling out to the Lord. And so it does play a very important role all the way through the whole process.

Tony Caffey: Your story is fascinating to me because we're in my small group right now. We're reading through Pilgrim's Progress. You talked about the kind of burden that fell off you when you were in that church. That's exactly what Christian experienced when he, uh, goes and he sees the cross and he sees the sepulchre and the burden falls off off of him that he's been kind of weighing him down. And it's funny too that you say, uh, you said that at first when you were evangelizing, you were really harsh. You can see that in the book because the first thing that Christian does is he goes to these other people. I forget what their names are. It's like Lazy and Obstinate or something like that. And he's like hammering away at him like, "What's wrong with you guys? You know, you need to drop your burden here." And, and I've seen that with, uh, you know, young believers, you know, they get really amped up and get really, uh, forceful, I guess, uh, which in some ways I kind of want a piece of that, maybe not the aggressiveness, but the energy that they have for the Lord because I mean, that's, that's great. Um, and then, you know, maybe over time that the Lord starts to smooth that out a little bit and you do start to trust the Lord's sovereign work in it versus your own, like, you know, recipe for how you share the gospel. I do want to ask you this though, because I've shared the gospel with a lot of people throughout my life and to be honest, Forrest, I've been rejected more than I've been, you know, I'm like that guy Jason who at your, uh, door, you know, I've had good experiences. I'm sure I've been able to plant seeds maybe in some of those instances, but I've had, you know, the door metaphorically slammed in my face when I've tried to share the gospel and that can be, you know, uh, dispiriting, you know, when you're, you're wanting to be an evangelist. So how do you and maybe you've had those experiences too, how do you feel when you go through something like that when somebody blows you off and how do you, you know, keep that from being something that negatively affects your, your heart for evangelism?

Forrest Tilger: Right. Well, I'm a constant, I'm an optimist. I think that's what, yeah. Yeah. And so I, that's, God wired me like that. I do believe that God gave me the spirit of, you know, I'm just, I'm, I, I have trust in him. Right. I think understanding who Christ is has helped me to do that. Um, understanding my role within the process, you know, of if I get an opportunity to, you know, to be able to share the gospel with somebody. Yeah. Um, it has helped me. It helps me understand, um, you know, earlier you mentioned, uh, this abrasiveness, if you will. Yeah, you know, there's a certain sense in which you're almost like using like a sledgehammer and really what it is, it's like a scalpel that you need to be using. And that comes over time and it's really is listening to the Holy Spirit, you know, and when you have a conversation with somebody, um, active listening, really understanding what they're saying. And I've found that to be the case that once you, you listen to someone and you can, um, repeat back what they said or have a way of acknowledging what they said, they, they open up, you know, and they realize this person's taking a vested interest in me. And I've really seen it as post-COVID, there's a real, people are, I, you know, I, I like to, um, one of the fruitful areas is at restaurants. Yeah, you know, because there's a waiter and that waiter is, you know, they're serving me. And so I will make it a point to identify what their name is and I'll call them by name. And then before I pray, I'll say, "You know what, me and my wife are going to pray for this meal. Do you have any prayer requests?" You know, and I'll ask them to have any prayer requests and you'd be surprised that they'll share their heart with you.

Tony Caffey: I've noticed that after COVID, something happened in COVID where people understood that life is very temporal and that gives you maybe just an open door to build the relationship with it.

Forrest Tilger: Absolutely.

Tony Caffey: Maybe, uh, transition to the gospel after you talk about prayer. Have you ever had metaphorically speaking the door slammed on you or somebody, you know, gets, uh, frustrated with you or or offended by your sharing of the gospel?

Forrest Tilger: I have. I had, uh, you know, in San Antonio, uh, everybody's a Christian. Right. That's the thing. Everybody's Christian. So we had, um, they had the Final Four.

Tony Caffey: Okay, it was in San Antonio.

Forrest Tilger: Yeah, I remember that.

Tony Caffey: Right. This, the latest iteration of it, the Alamo Dome, right? Wasn't it? Or was it the, uh,

Forrest Tilger: It was at the Alamo

Forrest Tilger: Dome. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Right. And a bunch of guys from our church, we decided, "Let's go down and share the gospel." And, uh, we were in Market Square and every single person I spoke to, "I'm a Christian, I'm a Christian, I'm a Christian, I'm a Christian." And so what I found is a lot of people, that's their, you know, that's their go-to, "Well, I'm a Christian, I grew up in church, you know, my mom was Christian, I have a Bible in my house," you know? And so I see that more so, uh, as a, as a an objection, if you will. Um, I have had an opportunity where I did have a gentleman that I was doing some street evangelism and he got very upset with me.

Tony Caffey: Okay. And you know, he was not having it.

Forrest Tilger: Right. And at that point, what was it about it that that pointing out the nature of human sinfulness or the need for God or

Tony Caffey: I was talking about Christ.

Forrest Tilger: Okay.

Tony Caffey: And the Holy Spirit. And he just wasn't, he seemed like he just became more elevated every time, you know, it's a conversation, uh, went on. He just became more elevated. And I look, the Holy Spirit is going to kind of, you know, I heard somebody say before, it's almost like, um, a metal detector, you know, when a military, the closer it gets, it makes it, you know, and so it's kind of a line right there. I've been more in tune with the Holy Spirit trying to identify, okay, where's the opportunity at? And so that's where that comes with that scalpel, if you will, as opposed to the sledgehammer.

Tony Caffey: Yeah. And Jesus does have these warnings about, um, you know, Pearls Before Swine and, uh, you know, even shaking the dust off your feet, going from one town to another town as you're rejected. Um, so we need to be careful not to, to press where the Holy Spirit isn't already at work and sure in a person's life. I think that's good counsel. I, I remember a pastor saying once that the goal with evangelism needs to be doxological, not soteriological, meaning that your goal is to honor and glorify God, not to get people saved because that's, as going back to what we said already, that's the Lord's work. He's saving and the Lord is honored and glorified when we share the gospel, even if people reject us.

Forrest Tilger: That's right.

Tony Caffey: And that really took, took the burden off of me, like, "Oh, you know, I can share and even if I get rejected, I don't have to feel like I've failed the Lord. He's honored."

Forrest Tilger: That's right. That's right. And, uh, I mean, there's some parallels there with preaching, you know, as you know, preach a good sermon, preach an okay sermon, you know, the Lord is honored in the effort that's put forth, even if, you know, people aren't, you know, getting saved every Sunday when I'm preaching or something like that. It's, it's the, the goal is doxological.

Tony Caffey: Yeah, it's not a numbers game.

Forrest Tilger: Right. And I mean, you have to be very careful about that. Yeah, the Lord added to their numbers daily, those who are being saved, right? And so from, from an organization, from a church ministry standpoint, if you, you know, the goal is to honor the Lord and how do we do that? Well, we share the gospel. We live out lives that honor him.

Tony Caffey: Yep.

Forrest Tilger: And he does, he does all the, he's doing all the work, you know, he's the one who actually put us in front of that individual in the first place. Yeah. And so trusting in him, that's only what's going to happen.

Tony Caffey: Good, Forrest. I want to pivot because I've alluded already to your father. You got three kids, uh, you got one grown and married, two teenagers. You, I'm sure there's people watching right now that have kids as well. One of the things that you've been tasked to do as a dad is share your faith. Right. Kids. Yeah. And raise them. You know, when we do baby dedications here, we, we ask parents to raise their kids in the nurture and the admonition of the Lord, to fear God, but also to do everything in their power to share Christ, share the gospel with them. So maybe just practically for some of the parents watching, since you've been through that with your boys and your daughter, you know, how did, how did you make the gospel a part of their life growing up? How did you minister to them? How did you evangelize those that were closest to you?

Forrest Tilger: Yeah. You know, it started, it, for me, it began with prayer. I'm going to go back to that. Once we identify, once we found out that my wife was, um, we're going to have a baby and my daughter, we started praying. And we pray not only for her, we found out it was a girl, we prayed for her future husband and her children. And we prayed that God would call them under them, call them unto himself at a young age that they would, um, cling to righteousness and flee from evil. That was our, that was kind of our prayer for our children. We would you know, we would talk to them. We would have, uh, Bible studies. We had books that were appropriate for them at their age at night. And so we would talk to them whenever we would do family devotionals as well. We're able to, what I'm learning, I'm sure I'm sharing with them as I lead my family, I'm going to share that with them. So I did these things, but there was points along the way where, um, as a father, you, you, you know, I, I saw some instances. I remember one time we were driving home from church and for some reason I was just in a bad mood. I'd been in a bad mood for almost like two weeks.

Tony Caffey: You weren't optimistic.

Forrest Tilger: I wasn't optimistic at that point. Right. I was in a bad mood and we're driving at home and we're at a stoplight, a stoplight, red light, if you will. And, um, and it's almost like the Holy Spirit will convicted me, huh? You know, I realized that I need to repent and I need to ask my family for forgiveness because, uh, I think it was they had, my daughter said, "Dad, it feels like we're walking on eggshells somewhere around you."

Tony Caffey: Ooh, that hurts.

Forrest Tilger: That does hurt. And so, you know, the Lord was, the Holy Spirit was giving me some insight in the fact that, "Look, I need, I represent Christ and I need to represent Christ, uh, to my family, you know? And so they need to be able to see a father who, when you know, when things are tough, uh, to God be the glory and I want to pray through, I'm going to pray through this." And so I repented and I said, "You know, I asked the Lord forgive me." And I told my family, we had like a little family chat. And I said, "Hi," and I said, "I need to ask for forgiveness." So I think being able to ask for forgiveness quickly as a father is very important because you want to role model to your children how they need to deal with these difficult things as well.

Tony Caffey: So just to clarify, you're a sinner saved by grace.

Forrest Tilger: I am a sinner. That is correct. Yes.

Tony Caffey: And we can, you know, as dads, we can make the mistake of, I've said this before, we're, we're moralizing our children instead of evangelizing them or even gospelizing them. So we don't want just good kids, we want gospel kids. One of the things that we're trying to do is steward them towards their, uh, a recognition of their sinfulness and their need for Christ. Not that we don't have rules, we need rules, we need the law, so to speak, but we're not saved by the law. We need, uh, that's a an oppressive burden for kids because I remember, I don't know about you, but I'm 13, 14, 15 and I'm like, "Man, I'm a sinner, I'm a mess, you know, and I, I can't fix myself." And that was, I mean, I was saved at the time. That was what the Lord used inside of me to say, "Yeah, uh-huh, you need something more than rules. You need the grace that."

Forrest Tilger: That's right. The law saved no one.

Tony Caffey: Yeah, the law does not save. Yeah. Right.

Forrest Tilger: And that's it. The law could, Christ wouldn't have to have done what he did. But he came and he, he's only one who ever fulfilled the law. "I came to fulfill, I didn't come to do away with it, I came to fulfill the law." And so it is, I think that one of the challenges you have in a church is if you have families where you have mothers and then fathers that are in the church and their children in the church and then their children in the church, there could be a sense in which it's very rules oriented and you have to be very mindful of that. Yeah. And so you have to be intentionality working on, it's not these rules, what's in your heart, you know? And you have to understand that the heart of man is wicked and deceptive and it's wicked to the core. And this, there's no good, there's no one good, no, not one. And so those were that rules come into play.

Tony Caffey: Right. Yeah, that's good. And I, I want to clarify too, you said with your grumpiness, you were on the way home from church. Right. So yeah. So leave kids to church.

Forrest Tilger: Right. Yeah.

Tony Caffey: There you go.

Forrest Tilger: This is the part in the podcast where I say, "Get to church. Get to church." Even, you know, I mean, and you, um, and so what, you know, so I've transitioned and then as I grew up, now it's, you know, I'm praying before service, before service starts, when I wake up in the morning, I'm praying for service, you know? I'm praying for those who are going to be in the seats when we do announcements, you know, one of the things I want to do is I want to, "Holy Spirit, would you please, all the distractions of this world, just take them away and help us, you know, to, to meditate on you and to learn from you today this Sunday, you know, because the world does want to give you the distractions and all these things that when I kind of cloud you and false, um, things are going to make you happy, right? Things that you need to be focusing on, but they're not these falsenesses.

Tony Caffey: Let me close with this one final question. Okay. And actually more instead of a question, just maybe some practical tips for people, you know, let's say they're not an optimist. They're more of a pessimist. Let's say they're not extroverted or working in sales like you are. They're shy or they're introverted. What, uh, what are some practical ways that they can share their faith with people, unbelievers, that they come in contact with? What are some things that you do that are, uh, maybe transferable to others?

Forrest Tilger: Yeah, I would say that if you are not somebody who is, um, starts with prayer. Right. The second thing I would say is, I've always loved, uh, in sales, uh, a four-legged sales call is when you have two people going. And so if you could have two people or you have a partner, I highly recommend that.

Tony Caffey: Okay.

Forrest Tilger: You know, Proverbs 27:17 says, "As iron sharpens iron, one man sharpens another." When you have two people that are evangelizing together, um, that's, I recommend that. So if you're somebody who struggles in that area, partner up with somebody who doesn't struggle with that area, you know, and you encourage each other in that endeavor. I think that would be nice. Um, ask for, you know, when you, when people are working for you, you know, whether it be a waiter, whether it be somebody who is replacing you. Yeah. And what was your question, "Can I pray for you?" Or, yeah, "Do you have any prayer requests?" That's kind of is, is how do you work that in?

Tony Caffey: Yeah. So it's, it's easy.

Forrest Tilger: So I'm really good at transitions.

Tony Caffey: Yes, you are.

Forrest Tilger: Yeah. And so for me, it would be, um, I want to, they're going to tell you your name. Yeah. Right. And so I want to repeat their name back to them. Yeah. And I'm looking in the eye and I'm going to, I'm going to say, "You know what, my wife and I are getting ready to pray. Do you have anything we could pray about?"

Tony Caffey: Oh, for the meal for them.

Forrest Tilger: Okay. That's right.

Tony Caffey: Oh, yeah, that'd be nice. You know. Um, and then what do you, is that just kind of like, uh, like you're throwing out a line fishing or are you wanting for them to circle back or

Forrest Tilger: Yeah. So remember that metal detector analogy. Yeah. Right now waiting for a beep. So I'm like, "All right, here we go. Game on." You know, uh, if you go to the same place on a regular

Forrest Tilger: basis, if you go to the same coffee shop, same HEB and you see the same person over and over, get to know that individual. You know, that says a lot. I think what people are looking for is they're looking for people who are sincere and they're looking for people who are honest and they'll grab it, they'll gravitate towards that. And that gives you an opportunity. You know, you don't want to be phony. That's one thing you do not want to be.

Tony Caffey: The best place for me has been always the basketball court. I don't know why, but that's the place where I feel like I'm able to build relationships. It doesn't, I, I don't, and I'm not the pastor in the room, you know, that we sometimes they find out I'm a pastor, but usually I can kind of, you know, under the radar be the guy out there and and I'll just ask leading questions like that. So a lot of times in my stage of life is, is, is, you know, "Are you married? Do you have any kids?" And once you can get people to start talking about their family and their lives, then they kind of open up and, uh, you know, "What do you do? What do I do? I'm a pastor. You know, do you guys go to, do you go to church somewhere?" Sure. That usually can be an opportunity to to talk with them.

Forrest Tilger: So, so it's interesting. So the last couple of times that I've, um, asked my waiter or waitress, yeah, their name and ask them for a prayer request, I was surprised at how just transparent they were. Yeah. Not even knowing me. Will they share their, uh, they share what's going on in their life. And so, um, work, that's an excellent opportunity, I would say.

Tony Caffey: Good. Thank you, Forrest. Appreciate that.

Forrest Tilger: Thank you, Tony.

Tony Caffey: Good talking about evangelism. Well, that's our podcast today for Theology in Action. Stay tuned for more podcasts like this and let me just encourage you to look for opportunities to share your faith in Christ. Share also your prayer requests with others or ask others for prayer requests. Be a good way to put into action the theology that we're talking about to. Okay. So for more podcasts like this, you can go to our website at messiahbible.org and stay tuned for more podcasts on Theology in Action.